To Clone or Not To Clone?
February 6th, 2014, 06:43 PM
#41
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Bloomfield, MI
Posts: 425
I say build it the way that you want, and be honest. The wife and I were looking for a Cutlass convertible because I thought that we could not afford a 442. We happened upon this one - real 442 in the color combo that the wife likes (made the purchase easier!), dressed up as a W-30 by the previous owner.It was priced right and needed some TLC.
It is a driver and we have fun with it. If it ever needs a repaint it will go back to base 442 stripes, but for now it is a 442 with W-30 stripes and emblems.
It is a driver and we have fun with it. If it ever needs a repaint it will go back to base 442 stripes, but for now it is a 442 with W-30 stripes and emblems.
February 6th, 2014, 07:09 PM
#42
Shaking out the cobwebs..
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Marysville, Michigan
Posts: 234
My twist to the clone debate,
My '71 Supreme Convertible is a 442 clone, done by the previous owner. He was fully upfront about it when I looked at it. Matter of fact, if I remember the Craigslist ad correctly, it was listed as a 442 clone.
I bought the car simply because it was in great shape, it was red and white, and a convertible. All of the criteria I wanted in a '70 to '72 Cutlass.
The fact that it had a factory steel framed ram-air hood was a bonus, as I had one already sitting in my shed, waiting for a car to put it on.
The 442 and W-30 badges on it was not a big deal to me (I'm kind of fond of the 'Cutlass' script emblem actually).
He even put in the red inner fender liners. No big deal there either, but when I opened the hood, they made a difference in the appearance of the engine compartment. I liked them much better than the black ones I had seen in other cars.
After I had seen this car, I knew that even if I didn't buy it, I was going to build one very similar to it.
The fact that it is not an original factory 442 W-30 allowed me to customize it how I wanted MY car to be.
Changed the rear end gears, new interior, engine rebuild with a big cam, headers, AC delete, custom stereo, etc....
Basically my take on the whole 'classic car' hobby comes down to this:
'If you're building it the way others want to see it, then you're doing it wrong'.
My '71 Supreme Convertible is a 442 clone, done by the previous owner. He was fully upfront about it when I looked at it. Matter of fact, if I remember the Craigslist ad correctly, it was listed as a 442 clone.
I bought the car simply because it was in great shape, it was red and white, and a convertible. All of the criteria I wanted in a '70 to '72 Cutlass.
The fact that it had a factory steel framed ram-air hood was a bonus, as I had one already sitting in my shed, waiting for a car to put it on.
The 442 and W-30 badges on it was not a big deal to me (I'm kind of fond of the 'Cutlass' script emblem actually).
He even put in the red inner fender liners. No big deal there either, but when I opened the hood, they made a difference in the appearance of the engine compartment. I liked them much better than the black ones I had seen in other cars.
After I had seen this car, I knew that even if I didn't buy it, I was going to build one very similar to it.
The fact that it is not an original factory 442 W-30 allowed me to customize it how I wanted MY car to be.
Changed the rear end gears, new interior, engine rebuild with a big cam, headers, AC delete, custom stereo, etc....
Basically my take on the whole 'classic car' hobby comes down to this:
'If you're building it the way others want to see it, then you're doing it wrong'.
Last edited by midrange; February 6th, 2014 at 07:12 PM.
February 7th, 2014, 03:52 AM
#44
BTW, I rarely do what other want me to do anyway...call that part of my character my nemesis LOL. Again, I had visions of building me what I want, what I would want to drive and building with my 2 hands., oh and trashing it with my right foot aslo, but as ya'll mentioned, I can use any and all the parts I want, with or without whatever I want and never ever misrepresent the car and not worry a millisecond about what anybody says behind my back LOL. Unless you have the cajones to tell me to my face and then, well, who knows 
right?
Ya'll get my drift yes?
right?Ya'll get my drift yes?
February 7th, 2014, 03:57 AM
#45
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Columbus, OH
Posts: 1,076
Just whenever someone says nice 442 be willing to reply, it is not real.
I do like the idea of leaving off the 442 badges to avoid any embarrassment.
I do like the idea of leaving off the 442 badges to avoid any embarrassment.
Last edited by Nilsson; February 7th, 2014 at 08:56 AM.
February 7th, 2014, 09:15 AM
#48
Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Mass
Posts: 1,119
February 7th, 2014, 10:46 AM
#49
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Columbus, OH
Posts: 1,076
Nope, because it would be acknowledging it for what it isn't. Just because you don't care, does not mean I don't.
February 7th, 2014, 11:37 AM
#50
Connoisseur d'Junque
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: The Hudson Valley
Posts: 21,183
I would say that if they compliment you on the 442, and go on to remark about the four-forty-two engine, then just smile and say "Thank you."
If they compliment you on the 442, and say it looks really original, then you kinda have to tell them it's not "real."
- Eric
If they compliment you on the 442, and say it looks really original, then you kinda have to tell them it's not "real."
- Eric
February 7th, 2014, 12:51 PM
#51
Shaking out the cobwebs..
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Marysville, Michigan
Posts: 234
I've been to many car shows, cruises, etc. I've only had one experience where the guys looking at my car, looked at the VIN, and shrugged and walked away.
These two never said 'hello', 'how ya doing', 'nice car', or anything as they walked up. They just barreled up to the cowl area, wearing their OCA jackets, checked the VIN, shrugged, and walked away.
Whatever. I got a chuckle out of it.
I seem to get the 'hey, nice car' the most from people. To which I simply rely, "Thanks" as they continue on their way thru the show.
If someone comes up to me and asks about it, 'Is it restored', 'Is it original', etc... I gladly tell them that it is a clone. Never has the conversation ended at that point.
To the casual car show/cruise night spectator, I have found it doesn't matter if it's cloned or original, they are just out and about, appreciating the nice cars.
These two never said 'hello', 'how ya doing', 'nice car', or anything as they walked up. They just barreled up to the cowl area, wearing their OCA jackets, checked the VIN, shrugged, and walked away.
Whatever. I got a chuckle out of it.
I seem to get the 'hey, nice car' the most from people. To which I simply rely, "Thanks" as they continue on their way thru the show.
If someone comes up to me and asks about it, 'Is it restored', 'Is it original', etc... I gladly tell them that it is a clone. Never has the conversation ended at that point.
To the casual car show/cruise night spectator, I have found it doesn't matter if it's cloned or original, they are just out and about, appreciating the nice cars.
Last edited by midrange; February 7th, 2014 at 12:53 PM.
February 7th, 2014, 01:00 PM
#52
Administrator
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Poteau, Ok
Posts: 40,627
Half the time people have no clue to what mine is and say nice 4fourty2 anyway. Mine has 1 Cutlass emblem on the trunk, bench, and column shift. The other half will walk clear around the car just trying to figure out what it is.
February 7th, 2014, 05:53 PM
#53
Our hobby includes a very diverse crowd of people. To me that is what makes it interesting. As much as I admire Corvettes it is very boring to go to an all Corvette show. There is a place for the Bloomington Gold crowd but a whole row of different color original Corvettes is Ho Hum. Same would be true for W30 442's. Mix it up. That's what made the streets so interesting back in the day. The reality is most true muscle cars were modified the day they came off the showroom floor and there were a lot more Cutlasses modified to emulate their more athletic brothers. It takes all kinds.
February 7th, 2014, 06:54 PM
#54
Do whatever you want - just don't put stripes on the #@%$ deck lid! 
I side with the gentry with the opinion of mod what you want sans badging.
I myself plan to install a console shift in my '64 and add the rally stripe which was only available in '65 - '66 but dang does it look cool. Have fun with it!
I side with the gentry with the opinion of mod what you want sans badging. I myself plan to install a console shift in my '64 and add the rally stripe which was only available in '65 - '66 but dang does it look cool. Have fun with it!
February 8th, 2014, 11:05 AM
#55
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Spokane Washington
Posts: 383
I'm stuck where aftermaket parts that are available, are for more collectable cars then mine. I used repop CS door panels with no guilt, they look good. I have scary, pinhole rust damage in the very nose of my hood with one option. go with a fiberglass, louvered 442 version for replacement.
Now if someone challenges me about that hood, I'll tell 'em that's all there is out there. If they suggest I'm showboating something I don't have, I'll run them down so they may examine the underside for factory correctness. In other words, we work with what's available. I feel sorry for the real show car guys that have to get everything period perfect. Too much research and insane prices to build one. There's a seller in my region with 2 real '67 442 hoods. He wants $1200 for the "good one". That may be fair market value but no thanks bro.
Now if someone challenges me about that hood, I'll tell 'em that's all there is out there. If they suggest I'm showboating something I don't have, I'll run them down so they may examine the underside for factory correctness. In other words, we work with what's available. I feel sorry for the real show car guys that have to get everything period perfect. Too much research and insane prices to build one. There's a seller in my region with 2 real '67 442 hoods. He wants $1200 for the "good one". That may be fair market value but no thanks bro.
Last edited by White_Knuckles; February 8th, 2014 at 11:40 AM.
February 8th, 2014, 01:29 PM
#58
Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Mass
Posts: 1,119
What exactly isn't it?
It's a car that looks like a 442. Take the compliment and thank them.
The compliment came from the appearance of the car not its paperwork - or lack of.
If someone comes by and sees the car, you see they notice a 442 badge, they say nothing ..... Should you walk up and say " I see you looked at my badging please know those are not correct for this car". Why not hang on sign on the car say it isn't a 442.
I only care if I'm going to purchase.
If you aren't buying it , I'm curious why you care.
February 8th, 2014, 02:37 PM
#59
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Columbus, OH
Posts: 1,076
What exactly isn't it?
It's a car that looks like a 442. Take the compliment and thank them.
The compliment came from the appearance of the car not its paperwork - or lack of.
If someone comes by and sees the car, you see they notice a 442 badge, they say nothing ..... Should you walk up and say " I see you looked at my badging please know those are not correct for this car". Why not hang on sign on the car say it isn't a 442.
I only care if I'm going to purchase.
If you aren't buying it , I'm curious why you care.
It's a car that looks like a 442. Take the compliment and thank them.
The compliment came from the appearance of the car not its paperwork - or lack of.
If someone comes by and sees the car, you see they notice a 442 badge, they say nothing ..... Should you walk up and say " I see you looked at my badging please know those are not correct for this car". Why not hang on sign on the car say it isn't a 442.
I only care if I'm going to purchase.
If you aren't buying it , I'm curious why you care.
If you owned a "real" 442 may be you would understand..
, but out of respect I decline to further argue with you the clone or not to clone. It is obvious you cannot accept my vote or opinion of the original question.
Last edited by Nilsson; February 8th, 2014 at 02:56 PM.
February 8th, 2014, 03:34 PM
#60
Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Seattle
Posts: 164
I used to be on the fence about this whole debate. I must say, when I drove my factory 70 Buick GS around, it felt really special, because it was a factory GS.
On the other hand, when I decided I had to have a 70-72 cutlass convertible, I knew darn well, I couldn't afford a real 442, though that's what I wanted. I searched for about a year for any convertible, that either had a 455 in it, or was affordable enough to do a transplant. I knew that no matter what I would definitely install an OAI hood, rally wheel, and a cut out bumper. People always customize cars with aftermarket hoods, and steering wheels, I just happen to like the factory stuff better than the aftermarket stuff.
When I found this SX all done up like a 442, I felt a little weird at first, but for 16k it had everything I could have dreamed of and I didn't have to do any of the work, so I nabbed it.
Short of the long is, every time I even look at this car in the garage it makes me smile, and feel 100 times happier when I'm driving it. That's why I own it. It's gorgeous, and it makes other people smile all the time. Sure, If someone asked (and they have) if it's a "real" one, I'm brutally honest, but if I had to do it all over again, I wouldn't change a thing. I certainly don't have guilt over it any more....
Life is short...make yourself happy
On the other hand, when I decided I had to have a 70-72 cutlass convertible, I knew darn well, I couldn't afford a real 442, though that's what I wanted. I searched for about a year for any convertible, that either had a 455 in it, or was affordable enough to do a transplant. I knew that no matter what I would definitely install an OAI hood, rally wheel, and a cut out bumper. People always customize cars with aftermarket hoods, and steering wheels, I just happen to like the factory stuff better than the aftermarket stuff.
When I found this SX all done up like a 442, I felt a little weird at first, but for 16k it had everything I could have dreamed of and I didn't have to do any of the work, so I nabbed it.
Short of the long is, every time I even look at this car in the garage it makes me smile, and feel 100 times happier when I'm driving it. That's why I own it. It's gorgeous, and it makes other people smile all the time. Sure, If someone asked (and they have) if it's a "real" one, I'm brutally honest, but if I had to do it all over again, I wouldn't change a thing. I certainly don't have guilt over it any more....
Life is short...make yourself happy
Last edited by Bluemeanie; February 8th, 2014 at 04:01 PM. Reason: just clarifying
February 8th, 2014, 04:09 PM
#61
Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Seattle
Posts: 164
I'd like to clarify that I totally understand, appreciate and admire the purist point of view. I think it's important to have respect for the real deal, and keep the pure breds safe and documented. Again, if money wasn't such a huge factor, maybe I'd be a little more hard lined about it. It's hard when you can (kind of) have what you want for way less money.
February 9th, 2014, 07:32 AM
#62
Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Mass
Posts: 1,119
You think because you own a 442 you are better than me? That's some elitist attitude you have.
February 9th, 2014, 07:40 AM
#63
Administrator
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Poteau, Ok
Posts: 40,627
My golden rule is... "The one who foots the bill gets to decide on how the car is built" When someone is willing to step up and stroke the checks, then their opinion counts, period, no exceptions.
February 9th, 2014, 08:22 AM
#64
Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 642
I agree 100 %. It is for that reason I would never let someone think I had "the Real Thing". To do otherwise would undermine the reason why I would do a tribute - respect.
For you golfers out there ..... Is Augusta National any less of a golf course because it is an homage to St. Andrews ?
February 9th, 2014, 08:24 AM
#65
Connoisseur d'Junque
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: The Hudson Valley
Posts: 21,183
What exactly isn't it?
It's a car that looks like a 442. Take the compliment and thank them.
The compliment came from the appearance of the car not its paperwork - or lack of.
If someone comes by and sees the car, you see they notice a 442 badge, they say nothing ..... Should you walk up and say " I see you looked at my badging please know those are not correct for this car". Why not hang on sign on the car say it isn't a 442.
I only care if I'm going to purchase.
If you aren't buying it , I'm curious why you care.
It's a car that looks like a 442. Take the compliment and thank them.
The compliment came from the appearance of the car not its paperwork - or lack of.
If someone comes by and sees the car, you see they notice a 442 badge, they say nothing ..... Should you walk up and say " I see you looked at my badging please know those are not correct for this car". Why not hang on sign on the car say it isn't a 442.
I only care if I'm going to purchase.
If you aren't buying it , I'm curious why you care.
The bottom line, and I have said this several times in the past, is that, aside from the amounts of hard-earned money, hard-bought time, and just-plain-hard work any of us has personally put into a car (which we could have put into anything, from a tractor, to an airplane, to a train set, to a butterfly collection, and which is the same amount of work and money, whether the car is a 442 / SS / GTO / GS, etc. or whether it is a straight-6 granny car), the actual car which we have painstakingly restored (or, more often, over-restored) is a low-technology, high-production, slapped-together consumer product designed and built to last about 7 years and 100,000 miles and then fall apart.
We are NOT talking about lovingly-crafted Maseratis or Lamborghinis here, or even meticulously designed Porsches. We are talking about extremely generic, and once extremely common American cars, designed to be built as quickly and cheaply as possible, and be only as fast and as comfortable as necessary.
If a person has created a "clone" with good attention to detail, then there is no difference between it and a 442, and the actual parts used to make it a "clone" (pot metal, plastic, and stainless steel trim pieces and a few internal parts) are different from, but no better than, the "regular" parts (such as pistons of different compression, made to the same engineering standards of the same materials as the "regular" pistons).
442s, when new, were no better than any other Oldsmobiles. They came down the same lines and received the same amount of care.
They did not have seats made of Corinthian leather in a special upholstery shop by special artisans, did not have their blocks, cams, cranks, and pistons forged of special alloys in special fires, and did not have their paint applied and hand-rubbed by Detroit's last remaining Virgins.
If you put the same mediocre 442 parts onto a mediocre Cutlass, then that car is no different from a 442.
The only difference that there is (depending on year) is either a piece of tin on the firewall with a different dent in it, signifying a different digit, or, possibly, only a piece of tattered paper. In that case, since the car itself, once it has been completely disassembled and lovingly restored, is absolutely no different from a "clone" (ie: no, or almost no, original 442 parts remain on the car, as most have been purchased either from repro houses or from parts cars), except for that single piece or paper, this is another way of saying that the piece of paper itself is what is valuable. (Which do you keep in the safe - the car or the build sheet?).
If you're cool with the most important thing about your car restoration being a piece of paper or a dent in a piece of tin, then that's okay, but it's really all we're talking about here, and, frankly, I'd rather see people build and enjoy their cars for what they are, and leave the pieces of paper for the stamp collectors.
- Eric
ps: No, I don't want to hear about Canadian documentation. You're missing the point. Is it the car or the paper that's important? Bunch of Socialists, anyway...
February 9th, 2014, 08:28 AM
#66
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Cazenovia, NY
Posts: 206
Agreed, some 442 options just look better and for the price they should. My Frankenstein of a cutlass has a '70 442 hood and wing, a '73 455 Block and recently purchased Hurst/442 grilles. All I know is no matter what if you're driving an olds youre going to get a lot of looks and a lot of thumbs ups.
February 9th, 2014, 10:42 AM
#70
Sammy70 455 Supreme
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Port Perry, Ontario
Posts: 3,069
So now we finally arrive at the crux of the question.
The bottom line, and I have said this several times in the past, is that, aside from the amounts of hard-earned money, hard-bought time, and just-plain-hard work any of us has personally put into a car (which we could have put into anything, from a tractor, to an airplane, to a train set, to a butterfly collection, and which is the same amount of work and money, whether the car is a 442 / SS / GTO / GS, etc. or whether it is a straight-6 granny car), the actual car which we have painstakingly restored (or, more often, over-restored) is a low-technology, high-production, slapped-together consumer product designed and built to last about 7 years and 100,000 miles and then fall apart.
We are NOT talking about lovingly-crafted Maseratis or Lamborghinis here, or even meticulously designed Porsches. We are talking about extremely generic, and once extremely common American cars, designed to be built as quickly and cheaply as possible, and be only as fast and as comfortable as necessary.
If a person has created a "clone" with good attention to detail, then there is no difference between it and a 442, and the actual parts used to make it a "clone" (pot metal, plastic, and stainless steel trim pieces and a few internal parts) are different from, but no better than, the "regular" parts (such as pistons of different compression, made to the same engineering standards of the same materials as the "regular" pistons).
442s, when new, were no better than any other Oldsmobiles. They came down the same lines and received the same amount of care.
They did not have seats made of Corinthian leather in a special upholstery shop by special artisans, did not have their blocks, cams, cranks, and pistons forged of special alloys in special fires, and did not have their paint applied and hand-rubbed by Detroit's last remaining Virgins.
If you put the same mediocre 442 parts onto a mediocre Cutlass, then that car is no different from a 442.
The only difference that there is (depending on year) is either a piece of tin on the firewall with a different dent in it, signifying a different digit, or, possibly, only a piece of tattered paper. In that case, since the car itself, once it has been completely disassembled and lovingly restored, is absolutely no different from a "clone" (ie: no, or almost no, original 442 parts remain on the car, as most have been purchased either from repro houses or from parts cars), except for that single piece or paper, this is another way of saying that the piece of paper itself is what is valuable. (Which do you keep in the safe - the car or the build sheet?).
If you're cool with the most important thing about your car restoration being a piece of paper or a dent in a piece of tin, then that's okay, but it's really all we're talking about here, and, frankly, I'd rather see people build and enjoy their cars for what they are, and leave the pieces of paper for the stamp collectors.
- Eric
ps: No, I don't want to hear about Canadian documentation. You're missing the point. Is it the car or the paper that's important? Bunch of Socialists, anyway...
The bottom line, and I have said this several times in the past, is that, aside from the amounts of hard-earned money, hard-bought time, and just-plain-hard work any of us has personally put into a car (which we could have put into anything, from a tractor, to an airplane, to a train set, to a butterfly collection, and which is the same amount of work and money, whether the car is a 442 / SS / GTO / GS, etc. or whether it is a straight-6 granny car), the actual car which we have painstakingly restored (or, more often, over-restored) is a low-technology, high-production, slapped-together consumer product designed and built to last about 7 years and 100,000 miles and then fall apart.
We are NOT talking about lovingly-crafted Maseratis or Lamborghinis here, or even meticulously designed Porsches. We are talking about extremely generic, and once extremely common American cars, designed to be built as quickly and cheaply as possible, and be only as fast and as comfortable as necessary.
If a person has created a "clone" with good attention to detail, then there is no difference between it and a 442, and the actual parts used to make it a "clone" (pot metal, plastic, and stainless steel trim pieces and a few internal parts) are different from, but no better than, the "regular" parts (such as pistons of different compression, made to the same engineering standards of the same materials as the "regular" pistons).
442s, when new, were no better than any other Oldsmobiles. They came down the same lines and received the same amount of care.
They did not have seats made of Corinthian leather in a special upholstery shop by special artisans, did not have their blocks, cams, cranks, and pistons forged of special alloys in special fires, and did not have their paint applied and hand-rubbed by Detroit's last remaining Virgins.
If you put the same mediocre 442 parts onto a mediocre Cutlass, then that car is no different from a 442.
The only difference that there is (depending on year) is either a piece of tin on the firewall with a different dent in it, signifying a different digit, or, possibly, only a piece of tattered paper. In that case, since the car itself, once it has been completely disassembled and lovingly restored, is absolutely no different from a "clone" (ie: no, or almost no, original 442 parts remain on the car, as most have been purchased either from repro houses or from parts cars), except for that single piece or paper, this is another way of saying that the piece of paper itself is what is valuable. (Which do you keep in the safe - the car or the build sheet?).
If you're cool with the most important thing about your car restoration being a piece of paper or a dent in a piece of tin, then that's okay, but it's really all we're talking about here, and, frankly, I'd rather see people build and enjoy their cars for what they are, and leave the pieces of paper for the stamp collectors.
- Eric
ps: No, I don't want to hear about Canadian documentation. You're missing the point. Is it the car or the paper that's important? Bunch of Socialists, anyway...
Great points Eric......except for the ps part....keep your thoughts about the Canadian cultural landscape to yourself....has nothing to do with topic
February 9th, 2014, 11:08 AM
#71
Connoisseur d'Junque
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: The Hudson Valley
Posts: 21,183
February 9th, 2014, 12:08 PM
#72
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Spokane Washington
Posts: 383
..."did not have their blocks, cams, cranks, and pistons forged of special alloys in special fires"...
I did not know that. I was sure great magic and voodoo was factory applied?
I cringe reading how cheap the "performance option" was back in the days of yore. A car snagged then for nothing is now worth crazy money.
I did not know that. I was sure great magic and voodoo was factory applied?
I cringe reading how cheap the "performance option" was back in the days of yore. A car snagged then for nothing is now worth crazy money.
February 9th, 2014, 02:52 PM
#73
This turned out to be a very interesting read. Most interesting indeed and TY for everyone who has expressed their opinion/s. It is much appreciated.
BTW White Knuckles..still love that "gasserflake" burnt orange, it RAWKS
BTW White Knuckles..still love that "gasserflake" burnt orange, it RAWKS
February 9th, 2014, 03:22 PM
#74
Wow Eric sure popped my bubble! You mean Dr Oldsmobile wasn't at the end of the assembly line sprinkling magic fuji dust on every 442 as it left the factory? Next he will claim there is no Santa Clause..........
February 9th, 2014, 04:33 PM
#77
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Spokane Washington
Posts: 383
February 9th, 2014, 11:29 PM
#79
Ben
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Snohomish, WA
Posts: 1,825
The only time that it matters what you say is when you are selling the car.
Other than that say whatever the heck you want.
Considering the ridiculous comments that 99% of people have when they see our cars anyway, most wouldn't even know what the hell you are talking about if you said it was a "clone".
