MDchanic

He wasn't.

He took them from his mother's house after he killed her.

- Eric

z11375ss

I like this solution.


This is a two birds, one stone scenario. I would assist returning military and former military with employment by hiring 1 - 2 to police each of our schools. Those in authority in the school, Principal, Vice, Deans, would be trained and armed as well.

I CANNOT believe this discussion has to be had after every one of these occurrences. These are happening at so called "gun free zones", yeah "gun free" except for the mad man that IS ARMED WITH A FRICKIN GUN!!!

slantflat

"When you outlaw guns, only outlaws will have guns."

Don't know who said this but I think it's pretty spot on.

Dave Siltman

My heart goes out for all the families here---those that DID lose a child and those whose children will have this burned into their memories for the rest of their lives. It is so tragic that words don't even come close to describing the loss these people are enduring. The fallout will continue for a LONG time. What has happened to this great country where we live that some are killing innocent people for revenge. This needs to stop-NOW-
I will pray for those affected and hope that the rest of the world will, too.

MDchanic

I think I hear a keychain jingling.

I could type about an encyclopedia's worth of political commentary here, but I won't.

Suffice to say, as I think most will agree, that complex problems rarely have simple solutions.

I will be watching and listening for more information about this horribly tragic crime.

- Eric

J-(Chicago)

I hear you, Jim. And the funny thing is, if the principal had been carrying, and shot the madman, he'd be arrested. Then the madman's poor auntie Emma would probably win 10 million dollars because the evil outlaw Principal took her sister and nephew from her.

Things are coming to a point where burglars will be able to sue you for bruising their toe when they kicked your door in.

I agree on former military personnel as security.
A policeman would be less desirable in my opinion since the new crop of youthful officer's attitudes are geared more toward building cases against people like lawyers and busting heads open.
People are so sleazy nowadays that the police end up having to utilize that mentality.

Bums me out when my enlisted buddies come back and end up unloading semis on night shift at retail stores, or delivering pizzas.
Although, it was pretty awesome when my buddy Kyle came home from the navy and got a job at the local NAPA.

jaunty75

OK, this just brings up 10 more questions. Why does this kindergarten teacher own two handguns and an assault rifle? Regardless of the answer to that question, why does she have them stored in such away that her mentally ill son has access to them?

The answer to the problem here is not with the president or the governor or the police or better control over who can get into a school or gun control laws or whatever. Rather, the answer is much closer to home. It's taking responsibility for the deadly weapons you own.

jaunty75

Now they're saying he didn't get in to the building by being buzzed in. He just shot out a window. Nothing short of barred windows and barbed wire will keep someone out of a school who is determined to get in.

They're also saying that his mother had no connection at all to the school, and they still don't know what the shooter's connection was, if any.

http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2012/12/...hool-massacre/

jaunty75

Then again, this sort of thing is apparently relatively routine in Chicago.


10 shot, including 4 teens, Friday afternoon and night

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/l...0,912168.story

2blu442

As the information trickles out we're all spectulating on what could have been done to prevent this. We want to understand. We want our children to be safe. But if some twisted person wants to strike out in a big way they'll do it. If they don't have access to a gun, it could be driving a car through a crowd. It could be lighting a theater on fire. Crashing an airplane into a grade school. It could even be a suicide bomber... something that other countries deal with on a regular basis. I pray that never comes to our country, but am not optimistic. 9/11 taught us that the US is vulnerable to acts of terror.

I started this thread when I saw the headlines and said that evil exists. I still believe that. But let's try not to get into the weeds when we disagree with one another. None of us knows for sure exactly what led to this. Let's allow each other to hold different views and not bash one another. I have appreciated reading through the posts and learned from several of them. I don't want the thread to be locked, but if it gets too heated it will be.


John

jaunty75

What are your reading here that I'm not? I don't see any indication at all that thing are getting heated. They're not even mildly lukewarm. The only thing I can see that might happen is that it degenerates into a debate about gun control. But I don't see any indication of that so far. I think people are respectful and just expressing what they're thinking.

oldsguybry

I tell my son ALL the time that the game is ONLY a game , and it's pretend .... He surprises me at times when he brings this fact up all on his own without me saying anything . I WOULD not let my kid play these things AT all , but when they see dad doing it from time to time , I guess I folded after a while . The games he plays are all older games that are no where near as bad as the incident you described in the Call Of Duty game . I would probably have this game already , but I can't afford or justify spending that kind of money on a game at this point in time . The only game that comes close to that game , as far as life like graphics , and the actual shooting of another individual is Medal Of Honor from like 10 years ago . ( PC game ) I play this online against other individuals from across the globe . I've played this off and on for the last 8 years , mostly off then on now , because I just don't have time because of work and other important life issues , and of course my 72 CS . Hopefully this shows him that there is more important things to do in life then just playing video games . I have been guilty at times letting my boy play to many games . I guess because it keeps him busy , especially when his ADHD along with his defiant disorder is getting to much to bear .

oldsguybry

I wondered the same thing myself . Especially the type of weapons that they were ..... Sig Sauer , assault rifle , and I forget the other hand gun she had that the sicko used .

ah64pilot

I was thinking the same thing and almost posted but I didn't. I didn't want my post about there not being a fight to turn into a fight lol!

I did do a re-read to see if I missed something and the only thing I saw was that Z edited one of his posts...who knows? Maybe he said something he shouldn't have.

jaunty75

The mother was apparently an avid gun collector and once proudly showed her son the rifle. They're also saying they're getting good evidence as to what the motive was, although they're not actually announcing it.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/...8BD0U120121215

stevengerard

yep, quite frustrating that children are killing children, my neighborhood is just east of the Austin area - it puts into perspective the difficulties of this world and economy - plenty of wonderful people live there but definitely lower social economic backgrounds - 6 blocks north of me there are million dollar Frank Lloyd Wright mansions.

J-(Chicago)

It is. Chicago has been anti-gun for a LONG time, and had guns banned altogether.
Fish in a barrel.

jaunty75

I always thought that individual cities or states banning guns was worthless because it's so easy to just go to the next city over or an adjoining state if you live near a border, buy a gun, and bring it in. For a ban to have any chance of working, not that I'm advocating a position one way or the other here, it has to be nationwide. Even then, though, guns would find their way in.

z11375ss

Ah, Bananas! I posted a link to a youtube video that had Aussie's telling what happened to their country since the gubbermint took their guns away. The mods apparently thought this was incendiary. You can see it on youtube. The post I edited had some wrongful comments about police in general which I didn't think belonged here. What the heck is an assault rifle?

oldsguybry

I'm sure someone can get a better description of this , but an assault rifle has a shorter barrel used for more or less close range fighting ( hard to hunt with ) , and all the fancy wood and weight is basically removed to make lighter , giving it the military look also ..... also if you add the 100 round clip or drum , you now have an assault rifle . Obviously being fully automatic would complete the transformation , but that would be illegal here and most other places . If I missed anything , or if I'm out of my gord .... Please let me know .

Example ...... I had to sell my 1945 WWII British Lee Enfield .303 assault rifle a couple of years ago for money .....



This is what I had , complete with Bayonet , but in waaaay better condition .... It's bolt action , but they consider this a assault rifle too .

oldsguybry

I'm seeing posts dissapear that I was going to comment on .... Am I losing it or something ?

tru-blue 442

Don't feel bad. My comment was removed as well.

ah64pilot

I found it...I shared it on my fb page. Another good one is put on by Showtime, it's Penn and Teller's show called "B/S". Check it out on youtube, it's about 30 min. long. I shared that one on my fb page as well.

ah64pilot

Did you delete your own "no comment" post or was that deleted for you? LMAO!

ah64pilot

Are you on drugs? What is wrong with you?

Jamesbo

FWIW, That looks like an Enfield "jungle Carbine" to me. I don't consider bolt action rifles as "Assault weapons'

Lady72nRob71

Let's all watch what we are posting - read them through well before submitting. The admins are deleting posts that either have complaints reported on them or are in bad taste. We can close the thread, but I know we can all do better.

This was a very unfortunate tragedy and sad to say, they are way too hard to prevent. The larger the population gets, the more bad apples we get in the mix, not to mention not enough $$ and jobs to go around to make things even worse.
It can happen anywhere at any time by anyone. We just hope it does not happen again. We will never completely safe...

Rocket Richard

If you create a culture that loves cars it makes sense to me that there will be lots of cars around, and lots of car accidents. With an increasing number of cars around, the chance that a crazy person will get access to a car and wreak havoc will increase.

With a culture of car lovers there will be many car owners, and many of them will have more than one car. The responsible car owners will lock their cars in a garage. The less responsible ones might park their cars in front with the keys left in. Some cars will be used to get work done, some will be used to look cool. Some cars will be used for crime, some will be used for justice.

I don't want the government to take away our cars. I like to live in a free society where I can go wherever I like feeling safe that my car will take me home at the end of the day. But with all the people dying, both the bad drivers and the innocent ones in the passenger's seat, it will Is it good for people to love cars so much and have such easy access to them?

jensenracing77

Just my 2 cents... I have never heard of a shooting spree at Fort Knox.

May God be with all involved in Ct.

MDchanic

True, but they did have on at Fort Hood, where regulations have mandated for many years that only MPs (and private contractor police) may be armed.

- Eric

L69

This was a sad day in American History. My condolences to all the families affected.

Here is the wiki link http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sandy_H...chool_shooting

Oldsguy

There has been some self-moderation, and some work by our mods to keep this thread "friendly" thanks to you all for the efforts.

Olds Dad

x2

tru-blue 442

^^^x3

stevengerard

This is where I lean with this debate. I like guns, I like to shoot guns, I can't tell yo the last time I did though, and I refuse to own one with kids in the house, eventually I'll have grand-kids. Automobile laws have come a long way. No one likes too much government, why are there seat-belt laws - because too many people would not wear them if there wasn't when its proven they save more lives than not. As car guys we can all talk about the few times the belt has caused a death, but it has saved many more lives.

I don't know the answer either. I just feel it is too easy to get semiautomatic guns but if you outlaw them we would still have them. I don't smoke pot either but I think we should legalize it, I think that alone would reduce a third of the murders around the country. Its sad that gun deaths here in Chicago is just a normal part of a weekend.

z11375ss

A good article by Denninger, again. http://market-ticker.org/ Did you guys know the mall shooter a while back stopped shooting and killed himself because someone drew down on him? Never saw this in the MSM. Why not?

http://beforeitsnews.com/alternative...r-2515072.html

stevengerard

Interesting, but again he wasn't concealing a semi automatic rifle. And I would have to question if even 50% of the people have the discipline this guy had to not just start shooting back. I don't know that I would. I live in a town that bans guns, I like the idea of allowing ccw but will that turn us into a nation of first to draw wins?

slantflat

Years ago the city of Berwyn, IL passed a law saying everyone must own a gun. An odd law for sure and they didn't, to my knowledge, actively enforce this law, but crime went to near zero because the bad guys knew there was a better chance of getting shot if they broke into a house.

I don't know if the law is still there. This was in the 80s.

stevengerard

Did you live there? That kind of rings a bell but I would have said its a urban legend it you asked me that now. I'll ask, I know some berwyn leos. As for crime there now there is plenty. Lots of gangs in Berwyn and Cicero.

2blu442

Hi Steven. This sounded familiar to me too, but not knowing the details I did a search and came up with this:

http://voices.yahoo.com/firearm-owne...s-1418143.html

This search said it was actually a town in Georgia that required gun ownership in response to a to a town in Illinois, Morton Grove passing a ban of hand gun ownership. According to the search results this happened in 1982 and since then the town in Georgia has had low firearm related crimes and the one in Illinois has gone up. But you'll have to read through this and maybe other articles to see if you agree with their conclusions.

I know the news has had several reports considering gun control laws to reduce the chance of this happening again. Over the coming days/weeks we'll see what the investigation finds and hopefully our representatives will make well thought out steps rather than knee jerk reactions to this tragedy.


John