costpenn

In Section 11, Page 104, of my 72 Assy Manual, there is a part described as "410410 - REINFORCEMENT" . In the note, it's application shows to be for 35L77 & L75 with 35M20 - which I'm assuming is for 455's with manual transmission. Does anyone know what it's function is, and if anyone might have one for sale?
It's kind of interesting that the lower part of the core support that the air deflector and reinforcement are attached to is referred to as the "Tie Bar".

Allan R

Ha! Another one!
I've been looking for that part for quite some time now. I wouldn't assume that its for SMTs though. The AM simply states for use with the 455 engines. That could also be AT. What purpose does it serve? I don't know and most of the guys I've asked here don't either. This part was only on the 71/72 cars IIRC. Earlier years didn't have it - just the regular air dam. I've asked a couple of the guys who part out these A bodies if they've got them. None do

If I find one for sale? I'm buying it. If I find another? I'll PM you. Like you, I don't know what its purpose is because it makes no sense unless it's to attach other rubber deflector parts? If you ever find out the answer please let me know.

costpenn

Thanks Allen - I went back and looked at it again - I THINK what it means application wise is that it is intended for for L77 cars ( X code W30's with either AT or MT) or L75's with M20 (V code non W30 455 MT cars) - at least in 1972. I'll be on the hunt as well and let you know if the second one turns up......

1001coins

i had one on a 71 442 and one on a 72 4 door sold them both last year to the guy that owns inline tube, i think they came on any cutlass if you ordered it they are hard to find i was lucky

Allan R

Let the hunt begin..... Know anyone with a 71/72 X code car??

stevengerard

in 70 there is a "deflector, radiator lower" but does not show a reinforcement so it must be 71/72

Allan R

You would be correct.

stevengerard

which seems to be not often That's why I stick to 70 only

11971four4two

My 71 Z code (Fremont built) 442 has one. It would take an outrageous cash offer for me to consider taking it off the car.

Allan R

Oh yeah? What $$ would be outrageous? It's only 5 bolts.

costpenn

Would you mind posting a pic of it sometime - do you know what is it made out of? And, send me a PM with a price if you're really wanting to sell.

Allan R

that's dirty pool, I already asked.

11971four4two

Hi

I sent Allan an email. If he replies I will send him a picture of it on the car. I am sure he will be able to post it on CO. I could not.

The chin spoiler / reinforcement is made out of steel.

costpenn

Hey, it's my thread!

costpenn

Thanks for the info.

Allan R

Brian, return email sent. Thx

69HO43

I still got one on my 71. It's a Lansing car, but it's not a W-30 or 4 speed. In 71, it specifies 4400 series only, which pretty much meant any 71 442 should have it. Yep, it is metal. But it's not coming off any time soon.

Allan R

Here is the picture. The reinforcement shows up as a slightly silver shape centered behind the bumper, right?

I cropped the pic but still have the full size image of your car on file. Beautiful looking 72 fastback.

11971four4two

Hi Allan

The car is a 1971 Holiday Coupe 442
I painted the part silver when I had it off the Oldsmobile last.

72xw30

What are we looking for? Help please?

I still have my dad's original 72 X code car that I can go check if I know what I'm looking for.

Cheers,

Sam

costpenn

Thanks for posting> The only thing I can think of for the part's use might be to protect the plastic part of the air dam that points down from damage - but dont know why that was only a good idea for 442's - unless they expected them to be getting airborne more than the average Cutlass would.....

costpenn

Before you painted it, do you remember what color it was?

70Post

I'll try to get some good pics of a loose one I straightened/primed for a guy here. Hopefully he still has it sitting on his parts shelf. With some work a reasonable duplicate could be made...definitely would be a few hours but the thing wasn't so complex that you would say "no way".

They were likely painted black originally since the "marching orders" seemed to be a black finish on things hanging under the car that might be seen.

I suspect the repro guys like ILT would be doing the math on this piece to see if a repro makes sense.

507OLDS

They are really hard to find.They were one of the first things to come off the car.I would like to find another one myself.

11971four4two

The chin spoiler was weathered when I took it off the car. Likely a low gloss black , like the frame and chassis , when the car was new 40+ years ago.

Allan R

Dang it Brian! You were on my list of guys to call next......

Don't know if ILT would, but OPG, Year One and Classic industries might. From what I could see of the pic I posted for Brian, this isn't something I could pound out. It looks like a heavy gage stamped part.

70Post

It's not an extremely heavy guage metal....close to body sheet metal type thickness. I did a lot of straightening, etc on the one I mention.

Allan R

Can I borrow it for a month to make a repro?

70Post

I have to borrow it so I don't think it's "re-borrowable". You are proposing the same thing that, in part, put MF Global into bankruptcy...it's called hypothecation (and rehypothecation). Broker/dealers "lend out" the securities they hold for customers as well as their own. The borrowing firms typically re-lend them and so on. It's fine...until it isn't!! Then the whole thing comes unraveled AND FAST.

Thus, what you are proposing could possibly bring down the whole Olds restoration world should the original owner ask for it back at an inopportune time.

1001coins

heres apic of one i sold

mmurphy77

One on my car too. I assumed it was to keep the plastic air dam from warping - if you've even seen how badly warped the '69-'70 non-reinforced dams get, you know what I mean.

507OLDS

Probably the first thing that got bent when parking at a parking block.That's a real nice one in the picture.I would have dug deep for that one.

GAOldsman

I'll have to see if my Lansing built '72 Supreme has one. It is a U code with ram air from the factory.

GAOldsman

It seems the the '72 Assy. Man. page in question shows it is in fact for all A-bodies with a big block, it's just a matter of # of bolts attaching it. I couldn't find it in the '71 Assy. Man. but I didn't look too hard. The '72 edition page shows it was revised in Feb of '71 so it wasn't a mid year change for the '72's.

Allan R

Ok then, I'll change my approach. You give it to me and don't tell anyone. I keep it, stay mum, and am happy for the rest of my life!!

These weren't on 69/70 cars. Only 71/72 with 455's. But your comment about plastic dams going out of shape on 69/70? Why only on BB cars?

Scott, it's in both manuals. I looked and found them during my research. In the manual, it's attached with the rear air dam mounting bolts. The reinforcement bolt holes are supposed to line right up.

mmurphy77

That's what I'm saying - the '69/'70 dams warped BECAUSE they don't have the reinforcement the '71/'72 cars have. Since the plastic dams are essentially the same for '69-'72, it leads me to believe it was a 'band-aid' attempt to prevent the warpage.

Allan R

Ok, what I don't understand is what causes warping?? The same air dam used for 350's is the same as the one in the 455s. The 350's don't cause warping - my air dam still is nice and straight. Where and why does the warp occur? If there was a serious problem with this, why wouldn't the engineers have installed the reinforcement retro for 69 and standard for 70? Or did it take that long for the warping to show and an engineering fix to make its way through production into the assembly line? Not arguing, just trying to understand. Anything you can add would be appreciated.

stevengerard

I thought the airdams were a 400/455 only part even in 69/70, just in 71/72 they added the reinforcement

mmurphy77

Maybe it's not so much a warping problem as it is a parking curb impact problem that is resulting in permanent distortion and installation of the reinforcement was to try to combat that. Purely my own speculation.

Allan R

Well according the 68+ Assembly Manuals they are called "Deflector, lower" (part # 398171) Page 11-123 of the 68 AM

In 69 the part number is the same (page 11-111) of the 69 Assembly Manual.

70-72 AMs the part 398171 is the same. So it's a part that was supposed to be installed on all 68-72 Cutlass models. There is nothing in the AM that even suggests that the lower deflector (air dam) would be special for any of the A bodies.

It's only the reinforcement that enters the picture in 71/72, specifically for 455 cars.