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Man that back shape reminds me of an amx big time looks cool
I've had this shortened Toro idea for a while, so in a way, I'm glad to see this project in metal. Two Interesting points that coincide with the above Colorado project...
At 2 different times, two friends said the same thing about the AMX Javelin when I showed them my plan. (I think it is because the front overhang and the rear overhang have some equidistant symmetrical lengths, the fastback, and the lack of a waistline above the rear wheel like the Javelin.)
The other similiarity is I took out a theoretical 11" inches from the wheelbase and some on either end, which is about what this Colorado project did based on the post above.
Here's my initial concept on paper... Doug Staab concept
Last edited by Drive The Wheels Off; March 21st, 2022 at 05:06 PM.
Here's my initial concept on paper... Doug Staab concept
You DO realize that the length between the front wheel openings and firewall that you cut out is where the back half of the engine, the torque converter, the drive chain, and the transmission reside, right?
Wow, I love this idea. First thing I thought of was AMX too. I would have preferred that the doors stays a little longer, maybe shortening the quarter panel in front of the rear wheels to make up the difference.
You DO realize that the length between the front wheel openings and firewall that you cut out is where the back half of the engine, the torque converter, the drive chain, and the transmission reside, right?
He bounced a ten year old thread, so...probably not.
You DO realize that the length between the front wheel openings and firewall that you cut out is where the back half of the engine, the torque converter, the drive chain, and the transmission reside, right?
He bounced a ten year old thread, so...probably not.
"bouncing a ten year old thread" -
like that matters! Do you say things about all types of history?
I grew up around 8 of these cars, so I know them quite well. That part behind the front wheel and before the firewall was removed for logical reasons:
intended engine swap with rear wheel drive.
aesthetics - the Colorado car above (right side profile pic) illustrates the anticipated rearward look and disproportionate short roofline when that much of the door and roof are removed.
Last edited by Drive The Wheels Off; March 22nd, 2022 at 09:49 AM.
Sure, all it takes is a custom chassis. Ask Jay Leno about that...
Yes, Joe, the dimensions and chassis were all considered prior to putting anything to paper. A scratch built chassis vs. custom aftermarket chassis (already on the market) will work with these dimensions as planned.
Last edited by Drive The Wheels Off; March 21st, 2022 at 05:01 PM.
Wow, I love this idea. First thing I thought of was AMX too. I would have preferred that the doors stays a little longer, maybe shortening the quarter panel in front of the rear wheels to make up the difference.
Yes, Joe, the dimensions and a scratch built chassis vs. possible custom aftermarket chassis (already on the market for the dimensions) were all considered prior to putting anything to paper even.
None of which you shared with us. And when someone says an "engine swap for real [sic] wheel drive", it doesn't say "complete new chassis, suspension, and floor pan". Clearly you don't need anyone's help, just their adoration. Knock yourself out. We'll be waiting for the unveiling.
None of which you shared with us. And when someone says an "engine swap for real [sic] wheel drive", it doesn't say "complete new chassis, suspension, and floor pan". Clearly you don't need anyone's help, just their adoration. Knock yourself out. We'll be waiting for the unveiling.
Wrong 'Em Boyo. I simply was adding a different take on a build that I hadn't ever seen after years of considering this and searching for any out there. Instead of inquiring, you assumed I didn't know anything about the drivetrain dimensions.
Your first comment is a lame way of "offering help" from a guy who apparently spends way too much time on this site, thinking he's King because of the # of comments made. Meanwhile, he's the type who is an Admin's nightmare. Not uncommon, but unfortunate.
"None of which you shared with us", and, "it doesn't say "complete new chassis, suspension, and floor pan" - The thousands of car transformations in the last 30 years wasn't a clue to possibilities and probabilities to a know-it-all like you? C'mon Joe.
Last edited by Drive The Wheels Off; March 22nd, 2022 at 10:03 AM.
While I don’t have any problem with modern suspensions, I think it would be cool to take an A-body chassis and do some moving around and make it work. Do it as a kind of factory experimental instead of a modern interpretation. It’s almost got the layout of a corvette…I could see a C3 chassis working out well too!
"bouncing a ten year old thread" -
like that matters! Do you say things about all types of history?
I grew up around 8 of these cars, so I know them quite well. That part behind the front wheel and before the firewall was removed for logical reasons:
intended engine swap with rear wheel drive.
aesthetics - the Colorado car above (right side profile pic) illustrates the anticipated rearward look and disproportionate short roofline when that much of the door and roof are removed.
Yes, it matters. It shows a general lack of awareness, just like making your start in these forums by sassing established members. It's not a good look for you.
Hopefully, you see the illogic in your comment with respect to the existence of online forums.
By your logic, all new members shall have 100% awareness of all prior posts and shall not raise old posts out of sheer interest & continued dialogue, otherwise they shall be criticized for having lack of awareness. Another example of an Admin's struggle.
Last edited by Drive The Wheels Off; March 31st, 2022 at 01:41 PM.
Wow..maybe try posting this concept with a mindset for opinions and others questions about it..as a dialogue with other Olds guys..Many educated engineers on this site so you will be challenged..see it as working the bugs out of your post..Joe is actually the tech guru of this site and highly respected amongst many sites.. a no nonsense type with a plethora of usable knowledge.. cool concept for sure.. hey put your ego in check and stay on this site..I have learned a shitload from many members as well as made a few solid friends..
I have first hand experience with this very project
I bought a 68 Toronado that had already been cut and shortened as shown in the illustration. While I never measured how much was cut, I suspect it was more than shown here. I’m about 6-1 and 20 some years ago a little skinnier than I am now, there was NO WAY I could get behind the steering wheel from the drivers side. The steering wheel was behind the rear door pillar. If someone in readerland is seriously considering doing this, I’d strongly recommend the collapsing steering column. While the interior wasn’t finished (neither was any of the glass) I’m guessing it wouldn’t have been too difficult to drive from the backseat.
I paid 500 bucks for the car, the engine was later freshened for use in my 87 cutlass. None of the brake/fuel lines had Ben spliced back together, so it had no brakes, and needed a fuel jug underhood to run. Needless to say, other than driving it onto the trailer, I have no clue how it actually drove or handled.
I sold what was left to a friends mom who collected Toronado’s. There was a TON of chrome trim in the trunk, probably from the previous owners plans to finish the car. Probably trim from 10 different cars.
I may be wrong, but wasn’t there a shortened Toronado that was used for airport duties?
Originally Posted by joe_padavano
Not quite...
I believe he was refering to one of these. I have seen a few cut up like this on the internet. More of a home made rig than the airport cars pictured above and have been made of 4 will drive trucks and many different types of front wheel drive vehicles.
Last edited by Loaded68W34; April 1st, 2022 at 08:29 PM.
Hopefully, you see the illogic in your comment with respect to the existence of online forums.
By your logic, all new members shall have 100% awareness of all prior posts and shall not raise old posts out of sheer interest & continued dialogue, otherwise they shall be criticized for having lack of awareness. Another example of an Admin's struggle.
The majority of your posts have been insults to established forum members. I am not sure how you expect to succeed here.
The wildest one I don't have a picture for but was two of them welded together at the B pillar with flamethrowers. Drive either direction. It was a trailer de-icer.
That shorty was built by the factory and is well-documented. It was originally built as a prototype for the Lansing PD, who declined, so the factory used it on-plant. Note, by the way, that the one piece of that car that is NOT shortened is the distance from the doors to the front wheels, which is what I pointed out above.
It's really hard not to like that shorty Toro; someone in design has helped guide it's construction. It's obviously streetable, they've stuck an M plate on it and it has lights. It couldn't have been too much lighter than a standard Toro? It'd be a tough sell for professional duty with no sideglass though
Wow..maybe try posting this concept with a mindset for opinions and others questions about it..as a dialogue with other Olds guys..Many educated engineers on this site so you will be challenged..see it as working the bugs out of your post..Joe is actually the tech guru of this site and highly respected amongst many sites.. a no nonsense type with a plethora of usable knowledge.. cool concept for sure.. hey put your ego in check and stay on this site..I have learned a shitload from many members as well as made a few solid friends..
Hey Andy, my first post was greeted with Joe's initial assumptions that I didn't know or bother to consider the dimensions of the drivetrain with my rendering. I soon replied that I did know that and intended to use a rwd swap with chassis.
Read Koda's first comment to my original post which oddly writes, "He bounced a ten year old thread, so...probably not" in relation to whether or not I realized my rendering wouldn't have room for the original drivetrain. (yea, don't bother trying to follow his logic about re-visiting an old thread, especially since most of you continue this very cool conversation from 10 years ago. Gladly.)
Mind you, both of those comments were made before I could even get a chance to log back in after my initial post to get opinions from anyone. It's all above. I'll gladly put that behind, but this also needs written: most of you would stand up to Koda's initial attempt at insult, as you should.
Thanks all for continuing the conversation. The shortened concept is one I've admired and thought of for decades. As I wrote above, I'm glad I came across a tangible example of the production car being shortened. The continuous fastback line of the factory concept shorty doesn't include the "kink" near the trunk area of the original production car, which would be a loss, but therein lies one of many challenges to shortening the car while retaining that kink.
Last edited by Drive The Wheels Off; April 6th, 2022 at 10:24 PM.
It's pretty clear to me that other manufacturers are copying Oldsmobile. Just like the whole, OHV engine, airbag, automatic transmission thing. I bet MOPAR STOLE the idea for the AMX by looking at he Toronado. Just like Kia stole the design of their Soul by looking at a later model Toronado. Need I say more?!
March 19th, 2022, 04:30 PM
