johns72olds

Help!

I need to find some new or used drums that are for the "heavy duty" (11 x 2 drum) option. All local part stores only have access to the 9.5 x 2 in drum but offer the 11 x 2 pads. Very strange.
I have a call into Kanter.com to confirm the dimensions of the part they list.
Any help in locating these drums would be greatly appreciated.

11" x 2" friction surface with a 5 lug x 5" bolt circle

-john

rocketraider

11x2 with 5x5 bolt circle are not HD option for Dynamic/Delta/Starfire. They are the standard size brake drum. The parts store is trying to sell you Jetstar 88 brake drums which are smaller with Chevy style 4-3/4 bolt circle.

Your interchange is 1965-70 Olds except Jetstar 88 for sure, and I believe 59-64 rear drums are also the same. Ninety Eights often use a 2-1/2" wide drum which gives you an easy upgrade to larger brake swept area.

johns72olds

Thanks Rocketraider,

All the listings I have found show the 9.5 x 2 drum for the dynamic 88 (Rock Auto to name one). I have found nothing for the 11 x 2 inch drum. The note in the part listing mentions the "except heavy duty". How do I interpret that?
Like I stated above, I find it strange that the shoes are available but not the drum.

Do you where I can find them?

joe_padavano

This is yet another example of one supplier's catalog being wrong and every retail outlet just copies the incorrect info. (Yes, like headers for Supremes) Even RockAuto lists only the 9.5 x 2 drums for a 1965 88 and Starfire.

Unfortunately, no drum vendor that I've researched shows availability of 11 x 2 drums for the 65-71 cars. They DO show them for later cars (including my 84 Custom Cruiser, as an example). I don't know if the offset from the hub mounting surface to the friction surface is the same on the later drums or not. I'll try to measure one of mine this weekend and you can compare.

joe_padavano

Centric shows two different 11 x 2 drums with 5 x 5 bolt circle. The only difference appears to be the added skirt and larger fin area on the second, I assume for cooling. I've used both on my Custom Cruiser and both fit fine. By the way, these drums are shown as fitting as far back as 1971. They show no listings for prior years.

johns72olds

Thanks Joe,

I did see these but with mail order or internet orders, I wanted to make sure it was a fit so I didn't have to return them.
A rep from Rock Auto actually contacted Bendix for me to try and get some info, but they weren't very helpful. I think the pn was PDR0201 that showed similar dimensions to the Centric parts you show.
I didn't go as far as to measure the drum face to friction surface end. The original drums look like an old safari helmet and there just isn't enough meat to salvage them.

I'll keep on searching.

Thanks again,

-john

copper128

John, your location isn't listed, but I have a good sized stack of these drums in my garage. I could check through them to find a usable pair if you're interested in used.

Does anyone know the max. dimension for these? I don't recall any numbers cast into the drum like on the newer ones.

johns72olds

Hi Copper128,

I'm new to the posts so my profile was rushed. Funny thing is, I'm also in western NY. I live in Elma. I can look into the drum casting for some identification when I get home tonight.
I am very interested if you have a set.

-john

copper128

Wow, who'd have figured?
I'm in Hamburg. I'll PM you my phone #.
Glenn

joe_padavano

Just for future reference, could one of you post the measurements of one of those drums so we can see if the later ones fit? Thanks.

johns72olds

Joe,

I'll measure up one of the drums as best I can to see if the drum you mentioned will work. I would think others would be in the same boat I am and will need a replacement at some point.
I'm still curious about the shoes being readily available but not the drums.
Thanks for your comments.

-john

Rocket Richard

You can try Special Interest Cars in Ontario, Canada. I recently got a new rear drum from them for my 66 Dynamic. The guy I talked to said that they suppy Fusick.

If they don't have what you are looking for in their warehouse, they would be willing to find it elsewhere for you. When I dealt with them they seemed very willing to help. Very knowledgeable as well.

http://www.canpages.ca/page/ON/oakvi...s/1401700.html

-Rich

Rocket Richard

Just double-checked and the drum I got was the same as what you're looking for 11x2 with 5x5 bolt pattern. The guy at Special Interest said that out of thousands of drums he has, that was the last one. I was concerned about the fitment but he assured me it would fit, and it did.

He seemed pretty confident that he could find another to make a new pair, but I said no. Didn't have the time to wait for it to come.

Good luck!

66luvr

I have one rear brake drum from a 65 Delta, I saved it because I knew they were not available. The car was a 4 dr which was hit in the rear very hard, one rear wheel was smashed in the wreck, I couldn't get that drum off. But the other side I saved. If you are interested I could take it to my local machine shop and see how much meat is still on the drum and let you know.
I also saved the 2 front drums, I assume they would not work on the rear as no one mentioned that. They came off with the hub, some cars do and some cars come off separate, I have no idea if they could be separated from the hubs or not.
I see Joe listed the drums from a later model. I'll just throw this long sad story out there which includes something about later model drums. I put a Chevy 12 bolt under the blue 66. It came to me with a 456 posi (I still have the 456 stuff and would sell it if someone wants it). I bought a 3 series posi and 355 gears and all the stuff to install it, and new axles from Randys Ring and Pinion (that is who the mechanic deals with). When he got it all ready, I installed it. None of the rear brake drums I have here would fit on the axle flange, the flange was bigger. Randys says they are the same as factory, but BS, they are not as I have them and several drums and they will not fit. The drums all fit the old axles I removed from the 12 bolt, and a couple 10 bolt rears also, but not the new axles. So the easiest thing was to have the hole cut out to fit the new axles. If I am going to do that I want to start with new drums. My local machine shop is also a CarQuest Auto parts store. I have an Idea their stuff could be a little better than Auto Zone, but can"t say for sure. And I know all the people there and knew if I didn't decide to keep them they would not mind sending them back. So they did have the drums listed for a 66, but expensive. So we looked at newer stuff and ordered some for a 78 Olds 98 (I think), they looked similar in the pics, used the same size shoes and had the same bolt pattern. They worked fine, I had the guy come and use a tool to measure the axle to know exactly what size the hole needed to be enlarged to, he did the work, I put them on and they are fine. And were much cheaper than the ones listed for the 66 models. Just a "for what its worth" story. The newer ones Joe mentioned could/ might work, you don't know until you try them.
Mike

johns72olds

Thanks for all the comments.
I'm going to see if Copper128 can set me up with a pair for now.
I don't mind waiting for a new set if I can find them, but I want to get out and hit the local cruise nights with the weather being so nice.

Joe,

Dimensions for the drum I have are as follows:
(keep in mind that I used a tape measure and not a calibrated caliper)

From the inside
3" Hub
2-7/8" back of bolt face to end of friction surface
4-3/4" Tall (or wide)
15-3/8" Max OD
11-5/8" Friction surface OD
2" wide friction surface

From the outside
11-1/2" first outside Dia closest to rim
1-1/2" step
12-1/2 next outside Dia
flares out to the 15-3/8" max OD

5 bolt x 5.0" Bolt circle

Not sure how to add a pic so this is what I got.

-john

copper128

I have an old aftermarket part number for a cross reference: EIS Brake Parts #D2263
Just in case anyone has access to a X-ref. catalog.

John, it was great to meet you. Very glad I could help you get back on the road safely!

joe_padavano

This is the dimension I was concerned about. I just measured one of my drums and that dimension is 3.25". That would cause the drum to bottom on the backing plate. One might be able to machine enough off the rim of the drum to clear. The friction surface is actually 2.5", even though the shoes are only 2".

The next thing to check would be the dimension from the wheel mounting surface on the axle shaft to the flange on the axle housing. If this dimension is the same for the 65-70 cars as it is for the 71-up cars, one could swap the backing plates to the later units and be able to use the readily available 71-up drums on the earlier cars.

johns72olds

Glenn,

Thanks for setting me up. I was really impressed with your collection as I'm partial to the bigger full sized olds. Very cool cars you have.
It was a pleasure to meet you. Stay healthy and enjoy your retirement...and those cars.

Joe,

The dimension you observed was also the one I though would be of concern. The backing plate idea would be a good option to try at some point.
For now, I have an appointment to drop off the drums I got from Copper128 to a guy at NAPA that's going to clean them up so I can finish the install.
It's too bad these can't be more readily available but unlike chevy's, you can't go to the local drug store to purchase spare parts.

Thanks again for all the comments and happy cruising!

-john

66ninetyeightls

Not sure how I missed this thread. I was just thinking the other day I should look into this.

I am about 10 minutes from Special Interest Cars. I will have to go down and see them.

mpolds

If you are going crazy trying to find them -- STOP!!!!!!!!!! I have them, I have always had them -- they are 11" x 2" -- but they are not the same as Chevy or Pontiac -- they fit 1959 - 1970 Olds Full Size (except 1965 - 1970 olds 98 that used 11" x 2 1/2") ONLY.........

The old Century part # was C2263, Eis used D2263, Wagner was BD60037 and I can give you the part # in 8 other brands including DELCO.

They ARE VERY OBSOLETE from every company, however............

I HAVE them --- NEW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Call me --- Craig -- 516 - 485 - 1935...........

Rickman48

66lvr - wouldn't be easier to cut the axle than open up the center of the drum?
Permanent fix, and easier to do in a lathe - IMO!
Probably cheaper, too!

66luvr

Hmmmm, well everyone has a point of view, yours is a good one, I could have done that. But, I already had new studs pressed in the axles, the rear was together and finished, all I needed was drums. I figured the easiest thing was what I did. As far as price, since I don't have a lathe and would have to pay for the machine work I doubt one would have been cheaper than the other, but I saved the press work for the studs by cutting the drums, so I probably got by cheaper. Used drums for the rears are plentiful and cheap, I have several myself. But I started with new to be sure the drums will last well beyond my lifetime as well as my sons lifetime. Summing it up I did what was easiest and it will outlast all our lifetimes, including yours Rick, thats permenant enough for me.
By the way my son, who owns the 66, is also named Rick.

Have fun!

Rickman48

Having run a lathe, it could've been accomplished with the studs in, but having the cover bolted up and lubed, woulda probably done it the same way, myself!
Especially being one of those little 'surprises' we all get into, at the end!
Maybe engrave the center 'hole size' on the drum, 'cause you'll forget in 20-30 years!!!
I've a son named Rich, and I'm the oldest of 9 - guess what my fathers name was - rhymes with Rick!!

StarGeneral

This was in reference to 1965 dynamic 88 rear drums - the 11x2 ones. Did you guys ever figure out if swapping the backing plates was the only thing needed to go to 71 and up drums? and if so, what backing plates would be needed?

I just bought a stock brake drum for a 1965 Starfire from another guy but it has this massive "safari-helmet" flange on the outside and im not sure I can pair it with one that is not the same on the other side for my 65 88 without a weight difference...

Thanks so much!

joe_padavano

The weight difference is irrelevant on a car that is well over two tons.

The critical dimension is the axle flange "stick out" distance - the dimension from the flange that the backing plate bolts to on the housing to the wheel mounting surface on the axle shaft itself. If these are the same for the 60s cars and the late 70s cars, then a complete swap of backing plates and drums would work fine. I can provide the dimension from the later cars if someone has it for the early cars.

To clarify, the important dimension is the one labeled "offset" in the lower RH corner of this drawing:

StarGeneral

Joe, as soon as I get my brake drum off this week I will measure that dimension we are waiting on - I would love to put this problem to rest for future Full size olds owners!

mpolds

As indicated, previously, 1971 and later are 1000000 % different from
1959 - 1970, period.....
Of course, useless rock auto's listing is W R O N G --- Full size cars used
11" ONLY ---- N E V E R 9 1/2" -- that was Cutlasses / 442 s ----
rock auto CAN NOT service the 1959 - 1970 application because they are
not made in the chinesiumworld...................simple.

joe_padavano

Actually, the 1964-66 Jetstar 88s did use the 9.5" drums (2.5" front and 2" rear) and 5 x 4.75" wheel bolt circle from the A-body line. These are the only Oldsmobile full size cars that did use the smaller brakes until the redesigned 1977 models.

mpolds

I thought the discussion all along was in regard to 88s and 98s --- so I wasn't aware that I had to mention the exception.....
I apologize for being only 99.9% correct ---- from now on, I will include
all exceptions and I will continue to be ONLY 100 % correct.


Warning to all: Do not try and stretch the 9 1/2" 1964 - 1966 Jetstar
brake drums to fit 1959 - 1970 ALL Other FULL SIZE 11" Oldsmobiles...
It will not work......