When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.
I have a 1972 delta 88 4 door with a 350 rocket and it feels really underpowered I was wondering if that's normal or if there's something I can do to get more power out of it.
I was wondering if that's normal or if there's something I can do
Yes it is very normal, incredibly heavy car with a neutered 350 from the factory.
The base Delta 88 for 1972 had a 2BBL 350, 160 net HP and weighed 4323 LBS. 0-60 in 12.1 seconds. Over 10 second 0-60 is slow even for 50 years ago.
A stock 1971-1974 350 is good for 200 HP when its 4BBL and dual exhaust. But that is still going to have hard time trying to give a full size car some hustle. Here is a road test of a top of the line 455 4BBL 320 HP gross rating, 250 HP net rating, 1971 Delta 88 4 door. 0-60 in 8.8 seconds.
As said, 160 HP net in a heavy car, low 8 to 1 compression and a peanut cam. Add dual exhaust to start. There are good pistons to raise to mid 9 to 1 compression and a cam swap would boost power a bunch but will need a trip to the machine shop. If you can find a good used 455, it is the cheapest solution. The 350 is a great motor and can be stroked to 425ish CI and close to 455 torque but it costs thousands to do it.
In addition to what has been written above, the standard equipment rear axle ratio in a 1972 Delta was 3.08:1, with 2.93 as an option. Neither of those is particularly sporting.
I've got a '73 Delta 88 convertible with a 350/2-bbl which actually weighs a bit more than your car at 4400 lbs where yours is around 4350. My car scoots down the road if you just look at the gas pedal. I've had the car only since May, but the odometer says 63,000 miles, and I think it's correct. So I consider it to be a relatively "young" engine in terms of wear.
How many miles are on your car, or at least on the engine? Have you done a compression test? Low compression can sap power. Your engine might need new piston rings, as one thought, especially if it has any kind of mileage on it. How about the exhaust system? Any kind of blockage or other kind of restriction can reduce power as well. These are just a couple of thoughts off the top of my head.
This is a common "thing" on this site. People come on here complaining about this or that not seeming to work right on their car, and they immediately want to change things or throw money at it in some other way. Before doing any of this, there are two things you have to always make sure are true first.
1. Is the engine healthy?
2. Is the engine properly tuned?
While the 350 was the lesser of the two engines available in the Delta 88's of that era, cars equipped with them did not, as I recall, have a reputation for being underpowered. If your car seems underpowered enough that you notice it, I would start looking for causes before changing gear ratios or glomming on aftermarket parts or whatever.
thanks for the advice, I only bought the car about a week ago for $2,250 and recently found out the exhaust system is cracked in the middle and the engine is misfiring , the odometer says it has 58k miles
Last edited by kodah; December 13th, 2023 at 09:53 PM.
thanks for the advice, I only bought the car about a week ago for $2,250 and recently found out the exhaust system is cracked in the middle and the engine is misfiring , the odometer says it has 58k miles
If the odometer could actually say anything, I'm betting it would say 158K miles.
It's not a race car, it's a cruiser. Don't waste your time trying to convert the stock 350. To do it "right" you'll be changing everything...
If you do want it to be a race car, engine swap it. 455, or crate 350 hi-compression and all that jazz. Will be cheaper and a lot easier in the long run.
HOWEVER, I do very much agree with making sure it's tuned properly first!!! Get the service manual, there's lots to check and set. But even then, it's not gonna scorch the tires.
I have a 72 Delta 88. I put duals on it cause ya just have to!
It sounds mean as ***. She's a slow cream puff, but sounds great!
so update i just got around to replacing the spark pug wires and when i did, it would not fire so i put the old ones back on to see if i did anything wrong but it still wouldn't fire cause its not sparking. distributor looks brand new so yall got any ideas?
so update i just got around to replacing the spark pug wires and when i did, it would not fire so i put the old ones back on to see if i did anything wrong but it still wouldn't fire cause its not sparking. distributor looks brand new so yall got any ideas?
So it worked before you touched the wires and now it doesn't. Hmmm...
So it worked before you touched the wires and now it doesn't. Hmmm...
I'm going with you have the wires on wrong.
that's what i thought but i put them on as i was removing them to make sure i didn't mess it up, and it wouldn't start after so i put the old wires back on and still no spark
that's what i thought but i put them on as i was removing them to make sure i didn't mess it up, and it wouldn't start after so i put the old wires back on and still no spark
And again, the only difference is that you removed the wires and reinstalled them (twice). My money is still on an incorrect installation. Are you SURE you have the #1 wire in EXACTLY the same place on the cap as it was originally? Are you SURE you have the firing order going counterclockwise on the cap? Have you checked for spark at the coil wire?
My thought, too, and from first-hand experience. I replaced wires once and forgot to install the wire from the coil to the center of the distributor cap. Strange, that the car would crank but not start...
here's a thought. after you removed the wires, when you re-installed them, 18436572, in "COUNTER CLOCKWISE Rotation" ! OR did you re-install in "clockwise" rotation by mistake ??!
My thought, too, and from first-hand experience. I replaced wires once and forgot to install the wire from the coil to the center of the distributor cap. Strange, that the car would crank but not start...
That's not strange, that's expected w/ no coil wire. The ignition system has nothing to do with the starter motor.
You have to be willing to perform basic trouble shooting otherwise you are going down a rabbit hole and will get quickly frustrated and we cannot help. Do a little homework and ask for help if you don't understand the curriculum.
Don't throw parts at it. Find the root cause first. Plenty of good suggestions above.
Steer clear of any chineasuim junk parts(ask for country of origin, assume everything is chineasium junk). Never turn in original cores for the core charge. Keep them and get them rebuilt. The parts store re-manufactured parts are most often inferior in fit & quality. RUN from anything made in china, not sure if I mentioned that or not...lol.
BASICS:
Spark? Yes or no? If no why.
Standard points distributor or HEI?
Tools...Do you have feeler gauges, volt/Ohm meter, an inline spark tester, a can of brake cleaner and lint free shop towels? If no go shopping.
With the hold down clamp tight grab the top of the distributor with the cap off. Can you rotate it 180-360 °?? Crank the engine with the distributor cap off. Is it rotating? Any side to side play in the shaft?(up/down is OK).
Is the distributor installed correctly? With the engine on TDC(top dead center) the dist rotor tab should be pointing towards #1 cylinder and align with #1 tower on the cap.
Points distributor (dist):
With the ignition key in the ON position is battery voltage present on the positive terminal of the coil? If no fix that. Bad positive wire, bad bulk head connection, neutral safety switch etc...This is where you will need a volt/Ohm meter for continuity and voltage testing.
Inspect the contact points. Should be clean & pit free. Set point gap, (do not get grease on the points. Clean feeler and contacts with brake cleaner or electrical contact cleaner).
Verify dist centrifugal weights and springs are free and slightly lubricated.
Inspect the rotor & cap.
Make sure the negative wire from the coil to the points is not touching anything but the screw that attaches to the point set and the neg terminal on the coil.
You mentioned skipping when it ran. The - wire from the coil that runs up through the distributor base to the point set can sever internally from moving with the breaker plate(Vacuum advance) over the last 50+ years. The copper strands inside the wire stress and break. The insulation can look intact but the wire is electrically "open." This can cause intermittent continuity as well.
How do the spark plugs look?
YouTube how to test the coil primary/secondary windings with your new Ohm meter.
The ignition system has nothing to do with the starter motor.
I KNOW the ignition system has nothing to do with the starter motor. That wasn't my point. My point is that, if you leave off the wire from the coil to the distributor, the car won't start.
Steer clear of any chineasuim junk parts(ask for country of origin, assume everything is chineasium junk).
My advice is not to be too religious about this, and this works fine if it's 1970 and not 2023. Today there are many parts that are simply not made anywhere else, so if you want the part at all, and likely you will, you buy the made-in-China part.
MY advice is to stick with the brand names as much as possible. ACDelco is one. It's an old, historic American brand. But most of their parts are now made in China. But if it has ACDelco on the box, I will trust that they are exercising good quality control, or they wouldn't allow their name on the box. To date, I have bought many brand name but made in china parts and have had no problems.
The most famous example for me was when I redid the front brakes on my '78 Toronado. I replaced everything. rotors, pads, calipers, brake hoses, master cylinder. EVERY SINGLE PART, no matter what the brand (ACDelco, Raybestos, Wagner, you name it) was made in China. There's no escaping it if you want to actually run and drive an older car today.
I know I know and it is a sad state of affairs for this country selling out without remorse, greed and fat laziness.
The bigger problem for me is lining china's pockets and filling their coffers while we fill land fills and wast time replacing new stuff due to inferior quality, not to mention safety.
Sometimes I have no choice but to buy the inferior junk. Each time I do a little bit of vomit creeps up on my tongue...yum.
Do your part, I do, source USA made first. Ask the counter boy...err person, if there is a USA alternative, Make them look and work a little. Often there is for a few dollars more.
Wheel bearings come to mind. The first price given is always for chineasium. The counter person is trained to give the customer the cheapest part not the best part. The USA, Canadian, Swiss, Japanese or German made bearings are only a few dollars more and 10X in quality. Which one are you gonna buy?
Look at NOS eBay Craigslist, FBMP and rebuild it. Don't automatically go for the cheaper chineasium. That's what we are being programed to do. Often there is a USA alternative. Sure it costs more and it should. Are you really saving money having to replace it 2-3 times in a short period of time vs once, NOPE.
I aagree with Jaunty on this one. If you can get Made In The USA, go for it. But more often than not, chineseum is the only thing avaiable. I also agree with him on the coil to distributor cap wire. Even if you crossed up some of the plug wires, it should backfire or sputter.
Chinese people want reliable parts in their cars, too, and I doubt that Chinese factories have two assembly lines, one to make parts for domestic use and the other to make lower-quality stuff to ship overseas.
There was a time when "Made in Japan" stamped on a box was synonymous with junk, but that hasn't been true for a long time.
Also remember that it isn't just China. The automotive industry is totally world-wide. We went through this discussion elsewhere on this site relatively recently, and I pointed out that my '24 Buick Encore was made in Korea. An American-brand car made in southeast Asia. What's left? My '23 Silverado contains only 33% U.S./Canadian part content, and 38% of the parts came from Mexico. The truck was actually assembled in the U.S. at least.
With regard to parts, they can be made all over the world, too. In addition to China, I've had many boxes that say "Made in Mexico" on them, and other countries I've seen on boxes include Taiwan, Vietnam, and once in a while a South American country. I'm sure there have been more that I'm not remembering. Every once in a while, it will actually say "Made in U.S.A." on a box. I think "cool" when I see that.
My old cars are FULL of parts made abroad, and I've never had a problem. The brake job I did on my Toronado with all Chinese-made parts that I described above was now almost 7 years ago, and I've put about 10,000 miles on the car in that time. So far, no part failures have occurred.
You have two choices. You could obsess about where parts are made and live a miserable, always-on-ebay life, or you can stick with brand-names as much as possible, don't worry about where they're made, put them on your car, and enjoy driving it.
When I had a 94 Corvette, I did a brake job on it. I replaced the rotors all around. They were Wagoner and they were made in China. At the time which was several years ago, I thought there is something wrong with putting Chinese parts on a Corvette. I used them and have to say I never had a problem with them.
Even all Wix filters aren't US made. I got a really nice looking Wix XP cartridge oil filter for my Challenger, made in South Korea. Is there voltage and ground at the coil wires? Check the points for excessive burning. It should at least try to fire even if the order is wrong.
Last edited by olds 307 and 403; December 28th, 2023 at 05:04 PM.
When I had a 94 Corvette, I did a brake job on it. I replaced the rotors all around. They were Wagoner and they were made in China.
This can no longer be avoided. I've read that there are no aftermarket brake rotors made in the U.S.A. anymore. All of the brands you can think of (Raybestos, Wagner, Bendix, Centric, Motorcraft, Delco) are all made in China.
so im back with a very late update, i figured out both the problem of no spark and the power issue, the spark issue was just me being dumb and not realizing i unplugged the 12v wire to my distributor, and the power issue was because the guy who owned it before me swapped it over to electronic ignition and messed up the firing order. i really did appreciate the advice even though i completely forgot about my post.
quick note; i only got like 3 wires replaced before testing to make sure everything was working good and that's when my problem happened
still haven't finished the rest but she's been doing fine without them
Last edited by kodah; March 7th, 2024 at 01:12 AM.
Reason: more info
so im back with a very late update, i figured out both the problem of no spark and the power issue, the spark issue was just me being dumb and not realizing i unplugged the 12v wire to my distributor, and the power issue was because the guy who owned it before me swapped it over to electronic ignition and messed up the firing order. i really did appreciate the advice even though i completely forgot about my post.
quick note; i only got like 3 wires replaced before testing to make sure everything was working good and that's when my problem happened
still haven't finished the rest but she's been doing fine without them
A messed up firing order does not in itself cause an engine to idle fine and have a lack of power. It usually causes backfiring, an extreme miss, and the engine to shake.
Once you get your 350 running properly I suggest you power time it and add dual exhaust. I did that to a 72 Cutlass 350 2bll and it made a huge difference in performance. Unfortunately it was 50 years ago and I don't remember the ignition settings but i know I installed lighter mechanical advance springs and increased initial spark advance.
December 12th, 2023, 11:04 PM
